I know what I’m about to offer can in no way be considered anything close to scientifically accurate, but I do feel that it is at worse a fair example of what is going on in many of  Florida’s school districts.
As some of you know, last year I started asking 11/12 k students if they were, or had been, studying evolution in their biology classes and quizzed them on a few basic questions on TOE (which 80% of the students failed to answer). I also began talking to the same grade science teachers to see if they covered TOE in their classes.
Since August last year I have spoken to well over 100 students and 30 teachers from 19 different high schools, covering four counties. Hillsborough, Pasco, Polk and Hardee. I have documented the results, although I promised anonymity, particularly to the teachers.
As I said, I’m no statistician, but basically just over 72% of those students either covered TOE briefly or not at all and out of the teachers I questioned, 58% admitted they hardly taught the subject or ignored it completely. Ninety percent of the teachers said they are just trying to avoid conflicts with students or parents. Polk and Hardee had the worse numbers, then Pasco, with Hillsborough being the best. I’m sure if this research was conducted on a state level, we would find similar results, some counties faring better than others. However, considering that Evolution is a large part of the biology science standards, these findings are appalling. All districts should follow the standards without exception and this is just not happening.
You can have all the NGSS you want, but if the FDOE are not following up with any monitoring of the standards, district by district, they mean little or nothing.
I know as a onetime science teacher that the Biology 1 EOC Assessment measures student achievement of the Next Generation Sunshine State Standards (NGSSS), as outlined in the Biology 1 course description. The first Biology 1 EOC Assessment test administration occurred in spring 2012. Four administrations are offered each school year and occur in the fall, winter, spring, and summer. Teachers that avoid evolution are seriously short changing their students. Brandon are you going to avoid teaching TOE in your classroom in order to “avoid conflicts�
What a great idea. But it sounds like the baby is getting thrown out with the bath water.
Is it 80% of students failed to answer any of your questions or they failed to answer correctly?
What were the basic questions you ask?
Chris,
I’m not sure what you meant by the baby and bath water comment? As far as my questions, I only asked four and they were directly related to the biology standards outlined in the NGSSS. Several students were Creationists; the rest either could not answer any of my questions or answered very poorly basically just guessing. The questions were.
1 Explain Natural Selection
2 What is meant by “Survival of the Fittest’
3 Explain “adaptationâ€
4 What is meant by Co-Operation
1) It’s when you pick all natural food from the store.
2) In a zombie apocalypse, you can run faster if you aren’t fat.
3) Like, when they made a novel based on the Frodo movies, that was an adaptation.
4) Two doctors perform the surgery at the same time.
PS, everyone should be friends with me because I will make great zombie distraction.
Michael,
Great answers you get a A+
Jonathan,
From the questions you ask, it sounds like students are missing out on some very interesting and vital parts of biology. In your poll I thought the teacher response of avoiding conflicts with students and parents was the most revealing. With evolution now promoted as fact instead of theory, the molecule to man segment of the theory may have further tainted the whole idea. It probably is simpler (natural selection) for educators to skip over the science and avoid conflict with the implanted beliefs, i.e., my baby/bathwater comment.
Chris,
I would suggest you do a little research into what is understood by a scientific theory.
I would agree with your staement about the baby and the bathwater in the context you presented it.
If I can manage to cover human reproduction, I guess I can survive teaching evolution, Ivorygirl.
I’m not sure how teachers can get away without teaching evolution. Not only do we have the mandated end of course exam, my district also has mandatory district exams throughout the year (6 of them in total). So, evolution will be a huge part of one of those district tests. There would be no way to shrug off evolution unless you want nearly every student to tank a significant assessment that heavily affects students’ overall class grades! I’m guessing other districts don’t have these other exams, maybe?
Brandon,
This looks interesting on the subject. http://www.discovery.org/a/2543
The lead author of the Discotute article Chris recommends is one David K. DeWolf, whose perspective (and the “legal guidebook” from which that article was apparently cribbed) Ed Brayton takes apart, without anesthetic, here.
Pierce,
I don’t see where the stand up comedian, Ed Brayton takes apart anything as to the legality issue of teaching evolution or alternatives to the theory in the public schools. Could you point out where Lawyer Seth Cooper and Law professor David DeWolf are wrong.
Chris – Be most careful of dissing comedians: they now have a political influence at least equal to that of rock musicians in the ’60s.
DeWolf, as a Fellow of the Discovery Institute, starts out with wrongness by his choice of affiliations. Beyond that, consider these (non-Brayton) evaluations and reactions.
For my own part, IANAL (are you?), but I find the evaluation of Dover v. Kitzmiller in your linked article particularly questionable. True, the decision there is binding only in that particular district – but the verdict was so strongly and clearly stated that no competent lawyer would advise a client to take a similar case to court in another district without a major difference (such as a judge known as a committed creationist &/or teabagger). There’s a good reason no other “intelligent design” cases have gotten very far since Dover, and DeWolf’s insinuation that others shouldn’t be dissuaded strikes me as manipulative and disingenuous.
Brandon H (I hope you’re reading this…) – please note that once again the FCS server has remained on Daylight Savings Time while all the rest of us have fallen back.
Pierce,
You’ve got part of this right about todays politicians, they are comedians. Or is it chameleons?
I think you’ve missed the point. Nobody is pushing ID. DeWolf does mention ID, but the article sounds more about a teachers freedom to teach scientific criticisms of prevailing scientific theories. With that freedom I would think a teacher might be able to give evolution a soft touch and quietly move away from the controversy.
Chris – You read my comment about comedians & politics backwards for the sake of a cheap wisecrack, and then accuse me of missing the point?!?
… a teachers freedom to teach scientific criticisms of prevailing scientific theories.
Apparently you haven’t paid much attention since well before the Kitzmiller case: that is “intelligent design”. Lots of carping criticism, no constructive ideas.
With that freedom I would think a teacher might be able to give evolution a soft touch and quietly move away from the controversy.
In other words, shortchange all his or her students and potentially sabotage their future careers in any biology-related field as well as the elementary scientific literacy all citizens need in the 21st century. Should we give public school teachers the “freedom” to promote astrology, phrenology, and racist versions of anthropology & history too?
Pierce,
I’m not sure where you’re coming from with all the rambling. Students are being short changed, that was my point.
You’re wrong thinking the monkey story will advance mankind into the 21st century, we see the opposite happening with the tale. I suppose it’s possible you could be completely ignorant of time in history you live, Biblical predictions are rapidly being fulfilled right before your eyes, and you’re not seeing it. Regardless of what you believe the facts won’t change. To get a little better understanding I’d recommend watching the End Time Eyewitness video. It will cost you 5 bucks and shipping. http://www.wnd.com/2014/10/end-times-eyewitness-movie-4-95-today-only/
Ah, Chris, really? You want me to, you apparently have yourself, send money to WorldNutDaily for an “End Times” video?!?
And as for that “Biblical predictions are rapidly being fulfilled right before your eyes” nonsense, please note that “biblical predictions” are as vague as “ghost” photographs, and have been “fulfilled right before your eyes” for over nineteen centuries now. And counting, and counting, and …
I recommend you take a trip to Orlando and urge everyone to evacuate immediately – Pat Robertson did warn us it’s about to be struck by a meteor for flying rainbow flags, y’know.
Pierce,
Silly me, I guess the biblical predictions would be nonsense to you will your head full of monkey poop.
If you were counting and counting and counting you would have noticed Israel is the time clock. There are a number of things that need to take place as signs for the end of the age if the bible is true, I won’t bore you with to much and take time away from your ancestor fabrication. But here is a fun thing to consider. Along with other things blood moons are listed as signs or signals in scripture. The time surrounding each set of four blood moons which have fallen on Jewish feast days have coincided with major events for the Jewish people.
Four blood moons. 1492 Jews expelled from Spain, many move to America.
Four Blood moons. 1948 The nation of Israel is reborn as a nation in a day as predicted. Jews from 66 nation begin returning to Israel after the Holocaust. The regathering of Jews to their homeland began as predicted.
Four blood moons. 1967 During the six day war Israel recaptured Jerusalem. As predicted, after almost 2000 years.
Four blood moons. 2014-2015 Perhaps, or perhaps not, but it would appear the players of the Psalms 83 war are lining up. One of the reasons it’s believed Psalms 83 and Ezekiel 38 and 39 are two separate events is because the countries listed for Psalms 83 are not present to attack Israel in Ezekiel 38 and 39. If now is the time for the Psalms 83 war to take place the results will be Israel will have the ability to reconstruct the third temple on the temple mount uncontested locally. The third temple is where the antichrist will declare himself to be God and demand worship. Worship from you by the way, if you’re here.
It just doesn’t matter what you believe, it’s happening.
All of this discussion with Chris is interesting but way off the point. The question that we should be considering is “Why are not the kids learning evolution?”
I think there are 2 possible general answers: 1) the teachers are not teaching the subject for all kinds of reasons and 2) the kids are not learning it even it it is taught. Two ideas on the second possibility: a) the kids are being taught and are learning it FOR THE TEST and then forgetting it or b) the teachers are doing a really poor job of teaching, maybe because they are down-playing it. I am sure there are several other ideas that you folks can come up with. I have no data for any of these ideas.
Well there you have it folks, Pierce engages Chris in a scientific discussion, Pierce nails Chris to the wall and how does Chris respond? Biblical Prophecy, blood moons and the end times. Thanks Chris for once again showing us just disingenuous you creationists are. Your sole agenda is to have your particular view of religion taught in public school science classes.
I did some scientifimacul research and looked for the phrase “blood moon” in the King James Bible. Somehow that particular omen didn’t make it into the official list of signs and portents.
So I looked it up online:
Hard to say which of the references silly Chris offers in this thread is the silliest – but taking Hagee as “scripture” in itself is quite a contender.
As for Joe’s question, I think another recently published book, Going Ape: Florida’s Battles over Evolution in the Classroom offers some useful clues. Many teachers who’ve tried it have ended up harangued and harassed by parents, preachers, politicians, and principals. The same author is reportedly undertaking field research, including this issue, even as we type.
The idea that kids put it in their retain-until-after-the-test memory banks does deserve some study, but first we need more baseline work to see how all the other yes-this-will-be-on-the-test information (under the present classroom regime, just about everything) gets stored and dumped before inquiring whether students process evolution any differently.
Ivorygirl,
I see you’ve still got that air leak. There was no scientific discussion between Pierce and I. He missed the point and went off on bunny trails so for fun I did too. Also, my religion is not causing the problem, it’s yours.
Chris,
So lying for Jesus once again? You spouted “There was no scientific discussion between Pierce and I.†Really, even when you wrote, “but the article sounds more about a teachers freedom to teach scientific criticisms of prevailing scientific theoriesâ€, that’s not discussing science? We have all seen how poor your English comprehension is. Perhaps you have been praying to improve these skills? So I can only conclude that either Jesus isn’t answering your prayers or his comprehension is as bad as yours.
Pierce.
As Joe pointed out this is way off the point and we should move on, but for your information I’ll post it.
It wasn’t Hagee who coined the phrase blood moon. The term may have originated around 800 BC in the book of Joel 2:31, ” The sun will be turned to darkness and the moon to blood before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD.”
The significance of these moons was recognized recently by Pastor Mark Biltz who found that when a lunar tetrad of blood moons all hit on biblical Jewish feast days, world changing events happen. According to NASA the 9-28-15 or last blood moon will be a supper moon seen in Jerusalem during the feast of sukkot. This will not happen for another four hundred years.
What is significant about this set of moons is that presently there are a very large number of other ongoing circumstances and signals that also match with end time biblical prophesy. The blood moon is only one signal to be present just before the end of the age.
There is one thing we can be sure of and that is my bad spelling or Ivorygirl’s ignorance won’t change anything.
Chris – Uh huh. Sure. Don’t I hear your preacher calling?
A campfire-story from a sheep herders’ culture miraculously grafted onto the scientifically predicted 4-pack sequences of lunar-eclipses thereby proves the campfire story was right. – Only in Sunday School®, alas.
Did Hagee graft Joel’s nightmare onto the lunar tetrad, or is the gross old grifter grabbing the work of some other grisly Prophetâ„¢?
… a very large number of other ongoing circumstances and signals that also match with end time biblical prophesy.
Just as “circumstances and signals” have been saying for >1900 years. How long since you got your c&s meter calibrated?
There was no scientific discussion between Pierce and I.
Indeed. There is no scientific discussion between anyone and you.
Pierce,
As usual, I see you have nothing to offer but garble. Your faith does not match all the facts. If you’re confident that the drawings of fabricating transitional creatures will give you the assurance and peace of mind that there is nothing greater than yourself, then I suppose ignorance is bliss.
Chris – Thank you for supporting my closing point from a week ago.
Wanna try to answer my question from 11/3?
Pierce,
I see you still don’t understand the point in my comment. So there is very little reason to answer your off beat question. However, I’ll try just for fun. By the insertion of “in other words”, you’ve managed to implant your twisted psycho ideology into the paragraph. To answer your question, “Should we give public school teachers the “freedom†to promote astrology, phrenology, and racist versions of anthropology & history too?”, I think they already have it. Much of the foolishness you’ve listed here was at one time or another considered rational science an evolution can be accredited for some of it. Stephen Jay Gould wrote, “Biological arguments for racism may have been common before 1859, but they increased by orders of magnitude following the acceptance of evolutionary theoryâ€
If there is anyone negatively affected in the 21st century by the lack of elementary scientific literacy they should be able to thank our present system which clings to 19th century belief.