The ACLU has a recent blog post up entitled Creationism Follies: The 2012-2013 Edition. And wouldn’t you know it … Florida is on the list.
A biology teacher at A. Crawford Mosley High School in Lynn Haven, Florida, screened Creation Science Evangelism videos during an evolution lesson. The organization claims to be the “leading Christian-apologetics ministry, defending the literal interpretation of the Genesis creation account from the theory of evolution” and its videos purport to debunk evolution and suggest that evolution may not “be part of science.” The ACLU of Florida promptly notified the school district that the Constitution prohibits public schools from promoting religious beliefs about the origin of life and we are continuing to investigate the matter.
Here is the letter the Greater Bay Area Chapter of the ACLU in Panama City sent the school: ACLU Letter to Crawford Mosley High School. A quote from the letter:
Chris Martello teaches tenth grade biology at A. Crawford Mosley High School. As part of his instruction on evolution, he presents a critique of it. During class he has shown to the students videos by Creation Science Evangelism, including “Creation Minute Episode 4: Six Types of Evolution,” which suggests that evolution may not be “part of science.” Such promotion of creationism in the public schools, whether directly or under the guise of academic freedom or presentation of “alternative” theories, is unlawful.
The video can be viewed at the link embedded above. It features Eric Hovind trying to tell us that evolution is not science. If that is really being shown in a public school classroom, the teacher deserves to be fired because it’s obvious that the teacher doesn’t even know what science is. I can’t find much on Martello through basic web searches other than he appears to be a sports coach at the school. The ACLU has made a public records request for all of the school’s biology teachers’ evolution-related materials (lesson plans, tests, etc.). That should be interesting to see.
Creation Science Evangelism is based in Pensacola and was founded by Kent “Dr. Dino” Hovind in the early 1990’s. He was found guilty of not paying taxes and was sentenced to prison. His son, Eric, carries on his father’s legacy.
I wonder how the ACLU would object to an evolutionary fake museum. You could have all the bogus primates, fake fossils and imaginary transitional stories which have facilitated the belief that nothing made everything. Public schools students would have a chance to understand the foundational beliefs that they are told represent science. Would the ACLU consider that religious creationism?
Chris,
Your claim (lie) that ID is really super-serious science and “Darwinism†is only so much atheism using science as a prop shows just how pathetic you are.
Since you have nothing to back up either of those delusions, and indeed there’s much evidence against, all you really have is nothing but a lot whining when Christian apologetics isn’t treated as science.
Show us just what a clever boy you are and give us one just one piece of scientific evidence that supports Creationism. If not, shut the hell up and quit posting your inane comments on this site.
Better still, go buy a bag of popcorn and sit and watch your Ray Comfort movie, at least you can console yourself in knowing you’re not the only dumb ass liar for Jesus.
Ivorygirl,
I understand you’re a school teacher, that’s sad. You don’t sound very knowledgeable about your own faith. The cult is filled with great stories, like Nebraska Man who was significant evidence during the Scopes Monkey Trial. Or Piltdown Man who made a major contribution to the faith for years. Even Leakey published a book on fossil man called Adam’s Ancestors in which he stated, “The Piltdown skull is probably very much more nearly related to Homo sapiens than to any other yet known type.” He believed.
For instance a few examples for substance, around 2008 the National Academy of Sciences of the United States recognized a new species of cheetah, 2.5 million years old. The “new species” was the oldest cheetah ever found, It later turns out to be a Chinese fake made a short time earlier. How about Archaeoraptor and National Geographic story that the fossil was a “missing link” between birds and terrestrial theropod dinosaurs. Later it turns out to be another fake. It seems like all the supposed missing links turn out to be fake at some point. But before the frauds and misinformation is revealed, it’s called evidence.
What are you going to do with all the C-14 in dinosaur bones? You can’t claim they all are contaminated, there’s just are too many. Let’s ignore that.
Based on evolution’s assumptions, what would a transitional species look like? The phylogenic tree only shows fully formed creatures. None of the creatures have characteristics which might be useless until fully operational, like wings.
My point here has nothing to do with religion, but rather the bias of the ACLU, and now also U.
The only thing I see religious here is your devotion to the belief. If you can suck this stuff up, it’s ok with me. But I don’t have that kind of faith.
“What would a transitional species look like?”
Tiktaalik, for one. Discovered exactly where science predicted it would be.
Jerry Coyne tells the fascinating story in his book “Why Evolution is True.” You might consider reading it and learning a few things.
http://www.jesusandmo.net/2013/07/03/pow/
Scott
I’ve read several articles by Coyne including his video of “Why Evolution is True.” No one could say Coyne has not reached disciple status for the faith. However none of his gobbledygook actually proves evolution as true.
Tiktaalik is of no doubt a dead fish. However your information is a little out of date, Tiktaalik is loosing it’s charm as a transition. Not to worry, a replacement will pop up soon. http://www.nature.com/news/2010/100106/full/news.2010.1.html
Scott
If you’re able to step outside of evolution’s frenzy of rhetoric, you might find what many scientist are discovering. And those discoveries don’t look good for the theory. As you and everyone knows the only way to keep the corroding common ancestry dream alive is with the forced indoctrination of the belief. Evolution is big business and big money. Creationism in not what the hard core proponents of evolution are afraid of, it’s new scientific discovery itself. Here’s a good example. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgM_p9UfOeI
Chris – has anyone ever told you that real scientific discoveries are published through reputable journals, not YouTube vids?
Pierce
Check it out, prove it wrong.
Chris – I did view the vid, the whole damn dumb thing.
The core of it has to do with somebody calling themselves the Paleochronology Group (apparently operating out of someone’s home in Columbus, OH), repeatedly sending what they claimed to be samples of dinosaur fossils to a lab at the Univ of Georgia (funny, only 2 lines from each report were shown at a legible size, never including the name of the person signing each one). (Even the background on this gave flaky info – for example, claiming that the UG lab had recently pushed C-14 dating back as far as 55K years, though limits of 70-80K years were reported as early as 1984.)
At any rate, they claim that by applying the completely inappropriate technique of carbon-14 dating to dinosaur bones, they get results of less than 40K years. This will shock paleontologists almost as much as the world of astronomy will be transformed by my recent discovery that both the sun and the moon are smaller than my hand, held out at arm’s length.
This “Paleochronology Group”, according to the video, hasn’t achieved much beyond bothering people at a scientific conference in Singapore last year. They don’t have much of a reputation… but their results do have a Facebook page (via “Creation Science Movement”), including a link to their “report” at newgeology.us.
That last web address (” A new geology theory featuring impact-powered rapid continental drift – an alternative to plate tectonics.”) should provide hours of giggles for geologists. Like every good science site, it also offers essays on “why god allows evil” and how Michelson & Morely [sic] got their own experimental results wrong.
C’mon, Chris – at least try to find something to wave around that’s up to the Bob Jones University level.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23152462
Chris, Pathetic attempt at the “Gish Gallopâ€
If you can understand how unbelievable evolution seems to you, then you know just how bat shit insane Creationism seems to intelligent people and how utterly confused we are about your claims to take your primitive superstitions seriously. We will ask you once again to produce once piece of scientific evidence to support Creationism and that the creator was the god you believe in. Forget trying to produce straw man arguments regurgitated from DI or Answers in Genesis. Show us the evidence that we have been waiting for.
See there Scott, I knew a new transition would pop up soon.
Ivorygirl there are a few things missing from this article. You would think before this new icon could provide a thread of salvation to the theory, wouldn’t it be nice to have a little more information. How the fossil was dated and by whom? What would make this particular fossil a missing link rather than a variation of some existing animal or a extinct creature of the past? If it is transitional, what is it transitional between? And just what characteristics make it transitional? What documentation exist that shows this new find isn’t another fraud? Just throwing these unsupported fantastic claims on the table is what has produced a lot of mistrust and doubt from onlookers.
In looking for other articles about this new hope, most were just duplicates of yours, but I did find a jewel in the mess. It appears some sects in Islam are compatible with evolution. But they’re still trying to sell Archaeopteryx. The questionable bird remains on life support and at some point will more than likely appear as another posting in the obituaries. http://www.themuslimtimes.org/2013/07/science-and-technology/biology/video-fossils-reveal-missing-links-in-earths-evolution-after-dinosaurs
Ivorygirl
I’m not so sure you can categorize the believers of common ancestry as intelligent people. You’re only talking about 15% of the population who trust the full blown story of evolution. That would mean 85%of the population is not intelligent, which is a ridicules statement. Perhaps you might use the term ‘well indoctrinated’ to illustrate your point. Also I don’t think your problem is confusion, deception would be a better explanation for rejecting the obvious.
As to your question about scientific evidence, I don’t believe you are looking for that. But regardless of your faith, I’ve never seen nothing do anything. For me a creator is the only explanation considering the evidence proposed by the alternative. I’ve seen none of the criticism, name calling, assumptions, illustrations, or data which has produced the supposed convincing properties that can turn a dog into a fish.
I would like you all to make note that the question I posed (MULTIPUL TIMES IN FACT) to “liar for Jesus†Chris. “Produce one piece of scientific evidence to support Creationism and that the creator was the god you believe in, “he once again failed to answer. He has taken cognitive dissonance to the nth degree.
Chris’s babble clouded mind has no problem in accepting “An invisible sky daddy, talking snakes, talking donkeys, virgin births and walking zombies, all on faith. Yet when it comes to understanding a scientific concept he demands flawless evidence. Spewing out crap from creationist web sites does little to impress anyone; we understand that a single independent thought is way beyond your capabilities.
If you think you’ve shown evolution to be wrong, prove creationism is correct. Otherwise shut up.
Ivorygirl
With you low level of comprehension an total ignorance of the bible I would doubt you would recognize the evidence if it ran over you in a truck. I’ll be glad to answer your question. But before we start this conversation, how much study and how many times have you read the bible to thru. And what observable facts, not claims or ideas, theories or beliefs has brought you to the conclusion the bible is false.
Chris, Fortunately no one of any intellect really cares about your unguided opinions. Science isn’t about personal assumptions. As for the creator/ god you favor. My opinion, based on my feelings (just like yours) is that if there was a creator, then Poseidon is the likely creator. Now, show us evidence to prove that Yahweh has any more validity than Poseidon.
Don’t put words in my mouth pal,I never said the bible was totally false, just some of the anti scientific claims that it -you make. I have no intentions of letting you of the hook or allowing you to side track the issue. Answer my question. Produce once piece of scientific evidence to support Creationism and that the creator was the god you believe in. 1 Peter 3-15
I take it from your answer you’ve never read, studied or understood the messages in the bible. That gives us a better understanding of your irrelevant comments.
I don’t know if any success in answering you question can be obtained with your inability to rise above your indoctrinated belief. But lets take a shot at it.
This is a simple one.
Genesis 1:1 Â In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
Genesis 1:11Â And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.
Genesis 1:12Â And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
In verse 11 and 12 God spoke and the earth brought for grass, herbs and fruit trees after their their kind, with it’s seed in itself. The method of creation, construction or production of these plants is not described beyond he spoke it. Whether his word had the power to create or he was talking to ten million agronomist with the knowledge and material to produce the said plant life is not stated. But what is stated is plants were created after their kind, which if true should be evident in nature. So we should find uncross-able divisions of species. Herbs producing seed after its kind. Trees producing fruit with seed in the fruit which is the same type of seed the tree is and will produce the same type of tree.
This is exactly what we see. Citrus trees are and remain citrus trees. This type of tree won’t grow strawberries or swamp grass, just citrus. And it’s seed is in itself which only produces citrus. As a mater of fact no plant life can be bred or produce variation beyond a certain point. What we are looking at today scientifically confirms the claimed results in verse 11 and 12.
There is no physical evidence that scientist of today have or have ever had the knowledge or ability to cross potatoes with palm trees or any thing of the like. And there is no evidence other than speculation such an event has ever taken place.
In this case the creation model fits the scientific evidence.
Well, there you have it ladies and gentlemen; I will let Chris’s statement speak for its self. You all read the simple question I ask Chris,†produce once piece of scientific evidence to support Creationism and that the creator was the god you believe in and not another-say Poseidon†Such is the mindset of the creationist, that he would consider his response to be scientific evidence. Again, he completely avoids my question.
I must single out a couple of his statements that are worthy of attention… “Scientist of today have or have ever had the knowledge or ability to cross potatoes with palm trees†You know friends, if man came from monkeys why are they still monkeys? A 6th grader at my school could explain how man has genetically engineered plants. The common wild cabbage has become kale, broccoli, cauliflower, kohlrabi and brussel sprouts, all now separate vegetables. It would seem man has overtaken Yahweh? Well I guess it did take her 6 days to create everything, perhaps she needed some help so she could rest on the seventh…
Notice how Chris finalizes his statements (summarized) “What we are looking at today scientifically confirms the claimed results in verse 11 and 12â€. And “In this case the creation model fits the scientific evidenceâ€.
It may seem that way to an uneducated liar for Jesus like you Chris, but for anyone with half a brain, the vacuum ness of your ramblings are obvious. You don’t have a clue pal to what science is and how it works.
By the way, I was educated at a Christian school for 13 years and was forced to attend bible classes and study theology. My knowledge of that book is equal or superior to most.
Glad to here you have a Christian education, No one would have ever known, you don’t seem to know anything.
Your wild cabbage example was exactly my point. I noticed there were no butterflies, crab-cakes or oranges listed in your list of cabbage variation. I don’t think your inability or refusal to recognize the obvious is the result of pure stupidity but possibly the outcome of Romans 1:28 “Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done.”
Having the knowledge of scripture won’t provide understanding. John 3:7 says “you must be born again” As you say you know, without accepting Christ and believing that God is, you have no part in him.
Isaiah 55:6 says, “Seek the LORD while he may be found; call on him while he is near.” According to the book, at some point he won’t be near and you won’t find Him.
I’m not ashamed of choosing Christ and the forgiveness offered in the bible. When I accepted Christ as my savior He changed my life.
It all makes perfect scene. I believe the God of the bible is God for a number of reasons. Evolution may theorize but the actual evidence in nature supports the biblical claims. Recorded history supports the bible. Archaeology supports a biblical world view. The bible describes the heart of man along with the state we find ourselves in, science has yet to understanding the nature of good and evil. With a large portion of the bible being prophetic, it’s conformation to see those predictions happening. Many of the prophecies refer to Israel’s future. For those who look its undeniable that the seventh week of Daniel is shaping up quickly. We can see the entire world turning against Israel. What is more significant is that their dispersal and their return to the land was predicted thousands of years ago, which now stands as an indisputable fact. The third temple is predicted to be in existence during a period of time called Jacob’s trouble. The Temple Institute in Israel is in preparation for this temple and has fabricated the necessary fixtures for it. Thanks to DNA testing they have discovered the blood line required for temple priest. Aside from a few obstacles they are ready to build this third temple now. The Jews not accepting Christ as the messiah or the blood of Christ as the ultimate sacrifice for sin, will restart animal sacrifice using their blood according to the Old Testament guidelines. That should wake up the animal rights crowd. There are many other predictions which could occur in our time, such as the complete destruction of Damascus overnight.
As a whole for me the God of the bible is confirmed by the change in my life, and the change I see in those I know who have become Christians, the creation itself and the fulfillment of those predictions we see happening all around us.
Poseidon doesn’t seem to be around anymore, he must have fallen prey to your god natural selection. Natural selection doesn’t have any effect on mine.
Chris,
Yours mindless ranting reads like the diary of a teenage girl as she pours out her feelings for Justin Bieber. She wants Bieber to be just how she imagines he should be and they’ll be happy together forever.
You whined “Poseidon doesn’t seem to be around anymore, he must have fallen prey to your god natural selection. Natural selection doesn’t have any effect on mine.
Your right about that on the first count, Poseidon now lies on the scrap-heap of mythology with a host of other Gods that were thought by millions as theâ€one, true godâ€. That’s just where we will find Yahweh and Jesus in the not so distant future.
I know you believe in dinosaurs and that’s just what people like you are, religious dinosaurs. Well we all know what their final outcome was.
Ivorygirl,
I guess I was wrong about your inability to recognize the obvious. Both, pure stupidity and a depraved mind fit your psychobabble. Demonic possession would be no surprise.
Chris, Religion is a con and it’s a con you pull on your own mind. You can keep your organized superstitions and I will follow the beauty of real science. The only demons that exist, reside in the shriveled organ that’s your brain. You failed to offer any scientific explanations; all you have produced is a load of religious rhetoric. Still I’m sure that you feel much better knowing that you have, once more “lied for Jesusâ€.
Ok Chris and Ivorygirl, I never like to “censor” posts but you have reduced the issue to mere name calling. move on guys. Thanks.